I have created this forum for liberals to brag about all the examples of bold, courageous, and steadfast leadership of President Obama.

I'll wait.

He closed GTMO...
He brought Al Awlaki to civilian trial...
He kept unemployment below 8%...

He authorised the attack on Bin Laden. According to Romney (when he was seeking election in 2008), it would have been better to call Pakistan before such an operation.

Because of course the ISI would never have had someone who could warn Osama or anything...

He took you to war in Libya. Granted, American involvement was limited in tat war, but it was nevertheless a decision to send US troops to war, which is the very definition of Presidential leadership.

On the other hand, Romney has prevaricated on Libya. In March 2011 he was criticising the President for not going in. In April 2011 he was criticising the President for going in.

danivon wrote:He authorised the attack on Bin Laden. According to Romney (when he was seeking election in 2008), it would have been better to call Pakistan before such an operation.

Because of course the ISI would never have had someone who could warn Osama or anything...

Actually, your statement on Romney is false. Since you're ill-informed, let me help you.

MODERATOR: "Gov. Romney, respond to the mentioned reference to you ... by Sen. McCain."

ROMNEY: "Thank you. Of course we get Osama bin Laden and track him wherever he has to go, and make sure he pays for the outrage he exacted upon America."

MODERATOR: "Can we move heaven and earth to do it?"

ROMNEY: "We'll move everything to get him. But I don't want to buy into the Democratic pitch that this is all about one person — Osama bin Laden — because after we get him, there's going to be another and another. This is about Shia and Sunni. This is about Hezbollah and Hamas and al-Qaida and the Muslim Brotherhood. This is a worldwide jihadist effort to try and cause the collapse of all moderate Islamic governments and replace them with a caliphate.

"They ultimately want to bring down the United States of America.

"This is a global effort we're going to have to lead to overcome this jihadist effort. It's more than Osama bin Laden.

"But he is going to pay, and he will die."

As for the "brave" President: he insulated himself from blame and took more than his share of the credit. Unlike other Presidents with actual courage--Lincoln, Kennedy, Eisenhower, to name a few--this President has consistently pointed the finger of blame when something goes wrong and hogged the spotlight when anything goes well (he said a year ago that "spiking the football" re Bin Laden would be wrong. Now, it's at the center of his campaign).

danivon wrote:On the other hand, Romney has prevaricated on Libya. In March 2011 he was criticising the President for not going in. In April 2011 he was criticising the President for going in.

Yet, that has nothing to do with Obama.

Sassenach wrote:He took you to war in Libya. Granted, American involvement was limited in tat war, but it was nevertheless a decision to send US troops to war, which is the very definition of Presidential leadership.

Troops?

Not really.

Pilots, missiles and bombs?

Sure.

Outcome?

We don't know. We may have sacked one dictatorship for another. Meanwhile, thousands are slaughtered in Syria (as opposed to the hypothetical in Libya) and the President uses . . . semi-harsh language. That is the essence of abdicating leadership.

So is that all Romney said about Pakistan? I was thinking of the 2007 Romney reported in this link: http://in.reuters.com/article/2007/08/0 ... 1520070804

or who Time quoted as suggesting that going after Bin Laden was too much over one guy: http://www.time.com/time/specials/2007/ ... 27,00.html

Interesting that just like with Libya, Romney has a position to suit every taste!

Yet, that has nothing to do with Obama.

Only that Romney is the only realistic alternative for you in November. I know you set this thread up so you could continue your trend of attacking the President personally, but I figured we could do with some perspective. What better perspective than his possible replacement?

Government Efficiency
1.BROAD POLICY:
2.Established the President’s Management Advisory Board. ref
3.Streamlined and modernized government to save taxpayer dollars. ref
4.Ended previous practice of having White House aides rewrite scientific and environmental rules, regulations and reports. ref
5.SPECIFIC CUTS:
6.Cut salaries of senior White House aides. ref
7.Made $20 Billion in budget cuts. ref
8.Provided that Members of Congress shall not receive a cost of living adjustment in pay during fiscal year 2011. ref, ref, ref
9.Eliminated F-22 fighter jet program after lobbying Senate vote to strip financing for more jets from a defense funding authorization bill. ref, ref, ref
10.Canceled contract for new Presidential helicopter fleet (28 helicopters, $11.2 billion). ref
11.OTHER TARGETED ACTIONS:
12.Enhanced payment accuracy through a “Do Not Pay” list. ref
13.Cracked down on tax cheats (Exec Order). ref
14.Returned taxpayer monies for refurbishment of White House offices and living quarters. ref , ref
15.Established the USA.gov portal connecting people to the services they require. ref
16.Section curator: ^roytoric

Okay I'm cutting and pasting from a web site: I could be annoying and cuit and paste the content of 31 differenet categories, his people are claiming achievements within... But I thought that goverment efficiency and taxes would be interesting for Steve to deal with....
http://obamaachievements.org/list

Taxes
1.BROAD POLICY:
2.Adopted Economic Substance tax doctrine. ref
3.Cracked down on tax cheats (Exec Order). ref
4.TARGETED ACTIONS: TAX CREDITS/REDUCTIONS:
5.Temporarily suspended taxes on unemployment benefits. ref ref
6.Established consumer tax credit for plug-in hybrid cars. ref, ref

7.$60 billion in spending and tax incentives for renewable and clean energy. ref

8.Tax breaks to promote public transit. ref

9.Extended and indexed the 2007 Alternative Minimum Tax patch. ref
10.Small business teax credits for the cost of health insurance for employees beginning 1/1/10 (HCR).
11.2-year temporary tax credit up to $1 billion to encourage investment in new disease prevention and treatment therapies (HCR).
12.Income floor for medical expense deductions for individuals age 65 and older (and their spouses) remains at 7.5% through 2016; Raise 7.5% floor to 10% for all others (1/1/13) (HCR) ref
13.Health insurance premium tax credits and subsidies available for those with income up to 4x the federal poverty level (1/1/14) (HCR) ref ref
14.Accelerated tax benefits for charitable cash contributions for Haiti earthquake relief. ref
15.TARGETED ACTIONS: TAX ASSESSMENTS/INCREASES:
16.Made Haiti donations tax deductible for 2009. ref
17.ncreased penalty tax of 20% on nonqual distributions from HSA and MSA (1/1/11) (HCR) ref
18.Income tax rates for the highest earners will change from 35 to 39.6 percent. (1/1/11) (HCR) ref
19.Capital gains tax for the highest earners will change from 15 to 20 percent. (1/1/11) (HCR) ref
20.2.3% excise tax on manufacturers and importers of certain medical devices (1/1/13) (HCR) ref
21.For high earners the capital gains tax will rise from 20 to 23.8 percent. (1/1/13) (HCR) ref
22.A 2.35 percent Medicare payroll tax only on wages over the threshold (an increase of 0.9 percent) (1/1/13) (HCR) ref
23.Tax increase for corporations with assets of at least $1 billion (1/1/14) (HCR) ref
24.40% Excise tax on Cadillac health plans (2018) (HCR) ref
25.TARGETED ACTIONS: TAX ENFORCEMENT AND ADMINISTRATION:
26.Closed offshore tax safe havens, tax credit loopholes . ref , ref , ref
27.Employers will report the value of health benefits on W-2s (1/1/11) (HCR) ref
28.RESULTS:
29.Tax bills hit lowest level since 1950. ref
30.Tax refunds up 10 percent due to stimulus. ref

Notice the 29th point Steve?

Doctor Fate wrote:We don't know. We may have sacked one dictatorship for another. Meanwhile, thousands are slaughtered in Syria (as opposed to the hypothetical in Libya) and the President uses . . . semi-harsh language. That is the essence of abdicating leadership.

Pardon? Thousands of people were killed in Libya and they were not 'hypothetical'. For shame, Steve. For shame.

rickyp wrote:Taxes
1.BROAD POLICY:
2.Adopted Economic Substance tax doctrine. ref
3.Cracked down on tax cheats (Exec Order). ref
4.TARGETED ACTIONS: TAX CREDITS/REDUCTIONS:
5.Temporarily suspended taxes on unemployment benefits. ref ref
6.Established consumer tax credit for plug-in hybrid cars. ref, ref

7.$60 billion in spending and tax incentives for renewable and clean energy. ref

8.Tax breaks to promote public transit. ref

9.Extended and indexed the 2007 Alternative Minimum Tax patch. ref
10.Small business teax credits for the cost of health insurance for employees beginning 1/1/10 (HCR).
11.2-year temporary tax credit up to $1 billion to encourage investment in new disease prevention and treatment therapies (HCR).
12.Income floor for medical expense deductions for individuals age 65 and older (and their spouses) remains at 7.5% through 2016; Raise 7.5% floor to 10% for all others (1/1/13) (HCR) ref
13.Health insurance premium tax credits and subsidies available for those with income up to 4x the federal poverty level (1/1/14) (HCR) ref ref
14.Accelerated tax benefits for charitable cash contributions for Haiti earthquake relief. ref
15.TARGETED ACTIONS: TAX ASSESSMENTS/INCREASES:
16.Made Haiti donations tax deductible for 2009. ref
17.ncreased penalty tax of 20% on nonqual distributions from HSA and MSA (1/1/11) (HCR) ref
18.Income tax rates for the highest earners will change from 35 to 39.6 percent. (1/1/11) (HCR) ref
19.Capital gains tax for the highest earners will change from 15 to 20 percent. (1/1/11) (HCR) ref
20.2.3% excise tax on manufacturers and importers of certain medical devices (1/1/13) (HCR) ref
21.For high earners the capital gains tax will rise from 20 to 23.8 percent. (1/1/13) (HCR) ref
22.A 2.35 percent Medicare payroll tax only on wages over the threshold (an increase of 0.9 percent) (1/1/13) (HCR) ref
23.Tax increase for corporations with assets of at least $1 billion (1/1/14) (HCR) ref
24.40% Excise tax on Cadillac health plans (2018) (HCR) ref
25.TARGETED ACTIONS: TAX ENFORCEMENT AND ADMINISTRATION:
26.Closed offshore tax safe havens, tax credit loopholes . ref , ref , ref
27.Employers will report the value of health benefits on W-2s (1/1/11) (HCR) ref
28.RESULTS:
29.Tax bills hit lowest level since 1950. ref
30.Tax refunds up 10 percent due to stimulus. ref

Notice the 29th point Steve?

bold, courageous, and steadfast leadership

Notice the TOPIC of the forum, Ricky?

Anyone can post the White House talking points. There is a chasm between "leadership" and "claimed accomplishments."

First, since you socialists seem to suffer from ADHD, I'll remind you this forum is an opportunity to brag about your fellow leftist, Mr. Obama. Can you try and do that?

Danivon wrote:

Yet, that has nothing to do with Obama.

Only that Romney is the only realistic alternative for you in November. I know you set this thread up so you could continue your trend of attacking the President personally, but I figured we could do with some perspective. What better perspective than his possible replacement?

Hey, you can start a Romney thread. I wanted to give Obamites the chance to boast on the man's leadership.

danivon wrote:So is that all Romney said about Pakistan? I was thinking of the 2007 Romney reported in this link: http://in.reuters.com/article/2007/08/0 ... 1520070804

I can't help but noticing that is edited. Can we see all of whatever speech they are quoting? Not that Reuters would ever slant the news . . .

or who Time quoted as suggesting that going after Bin Laden was too much over one guy: http://www.time.com/time/specials/2007/ ... 27,00.html

You reveal two things here: 1) you did not read the politifact link I supplied, which debunked Time; 2) you cannot get your head around the fact that leftist journalists misrepresent Republicans (as Time did here). I'll post the link again and quote the pertinent piece, since you can't do it yourself:

In the interview, Romney also:

Said the country would be safer by only "a small percentage" and would see "a very insignificant increase in safety" if al-Qaida leader Osama bin Laden was caught because another terrorist would rise to power. "It's not worth moving heaven and earth spending billions of dollars just trying to catch one person," Romney said. Instead, he said he supports a broader strategy to defeat the Islamic jihad movement.

The conclusion:

Our ruling

An Obama campaign ad suggested Mitt Romney wouldn’t have agressively pursued Osama bin Laden by citing Romney's statement that, "It's not worth moving heaven and earth and spending billions of dollars just trying to catch one person."

The Obama campaign is right that Romney used those words, but by cherry-picking them, it glosses over comments describing his broader approach. Romney said he wanted to pursue all of al-Qaida, not just its leaders.

The reporter quoting him in April 2007 said he instead "endorsed a broader strategy to defeat the Islamic jihad movement." And he said just over a week later that he would "get Osama bin Laden and track him wherever he has to go, and make sure he pays for the outrage he exacted upon America … he is going to pay, and he will die."

So, will you stop lying or repeating lies and get back to the topic?

Interesting that just like with Libya, Romney has a position to suit every taste!

What is interesting, no, actually pathetic is more like it, is that you've really got nothing of substance to say about the Great Man.

danivon wrote:

Doctor Fate wrote:We don't know. We may have sacked one dictatorship for another. Meanwhile, thousands are slaughtered in Syria (as opposed to the hypothetical in Libya) and the President uses . . . semi-harsh language. That is the essence of abdicating leadership.

Pardon? Thousands of people were killed in Libya and they were not 'hypothetical'. For shame, Steve. For shame.

Shame on you is far more like it:

What is now known, however, is that while the death toll in Libya when Nato intervened was perhaps around 1,000-2,000 (judging by UN estimates), eight months later it is probably more than ten times that figure.

How many have died in Syria while the Great Man has practiced folding his hands? Many more than died in Libya before NATO arrived to "save" them.

Libya was more about BP and Italy having continued access to oil than it was about saving lives. If it was really the latter, we would have captured/killed Qaddafi in days.