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Post 04 Dec 2014, 8:51 am

bbauska wrote:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law

"As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1"[2][3]—​ that is, if an online discussion (regardless of topic or scope) goes on long enough, sooner or later someone will compare someone or something to Hitler or Nazism.[/b]


Ben Carson: No, I'm Not Sorry I Compared U.S. To Nazi German
y

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/b ... zi-germany

Currently second in early polling for the nomination for the Republican Presidential candidacy in 2016....
Obviously Carson is unperturbed by Godwin...
Godwin is usually appealed to in online forums to attempt to end a ridiculous line of argumentation....
But Carson seems to running free on this so far in public discourse.
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Post 04 Dec 2014, 9:55 am

And I would "Godwin +1" him as well as I did Danivon.

Just like what Danivon said was true, Carson's comments are true as well. Both brought in the Nazi response, and would be deserving of the Godwin award.
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Post 04 Dec 2014, 11:00 am

Currently second in early polling for the nomination for the Republican Presidential candidacy in 2016....


I've honestly never heard of him. Who is he ?
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Post 04 Dec 2014, 12:04 pm

Pediatric neurosurgeon
fox news contributor
conspiracy theorist
tea party fave...
and committed rhetorical godwin

http://thinkprogress.org/election/2014/ ... -election/

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/02/politics/ ... -gop-poll/

http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=21970
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Post 04 Dec 2014, 12:14 pm

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1295085/

Here is a good movie about his life.
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Post 04 Dec 2014, 2:31 pm

Ok, so he's a self-publicising loony with zero prospect of ever getting the nomination. No wonder I've never heard of him.
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Post 04 Dec 2014, 3:22 pm

bbauska wrote:And I would "Godwin +1" him as well as I did Danivon.

Just like what Danivon said was true, Carson's comments are true as well. Both brought in the Nazi response, and would be deserving of the Godwin award.

My comment was factual. Carson's was hyperbolic opinion.
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Post 05 Dec 2014, 8:37 am

rickyp wrote:Pediatric neurosurgeon
fox news contributor
conspiracy theorist
tea party fave...
and committed rhetorical godwin

http://thinkprogress.org/election/2014/ ... -election/

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/02/politics/ ... -gop-poll/

http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=21970


He's done more good in his life than all of us in this thread will do together.

The Left has chosen to attack him because he's black and has the unmitigated gall not to believe as they think he should. Furthermore, he spoke the truth while the President looked on! Oh, the horror!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFb6NU1giRA
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Post 05 Dec 2014, 8:42 am

rickyp wrote:Pediatric neurosurgeon
fox news contributor
conspiracy theorist
tea party fave...
and committed rhetorical godwin

http://thinkprogress.org/election/2014/ ... -election/

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/02/politics/ ... -gop-poll/

http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=21970


And, that is a pathetic description of the man. This is more balanced: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ben_Carson

Carson was born in Detroit, Michigan, the son of Sonya (née Copeland) and Robert Solomon Carson, a Seventh-day Adventist Minister.[1] His parents were both from rural Georgia.[1] When he was 8 years old, his parents divorced and he and his 10-year-old brother, Curtis, were raised by their mother.[2] He attended Southwestern High School in Southwest Detroit and graduated from Yale University, where he majored in psychology.[3] He received his M.D. from the University of Michigan Medical School.

Medical career

Carson was a professor of neurosurgery, oncology, plastic surgery, and pediatrics, and he was the director of pediatric neurosurgery at Johns Hopkins Hospital.[4] At age 33, he became the youngest major division director in Johns Hopkins history, as director of pediatric neurosurgery. He was also a co-director of the Johns Hopkins Craniofacial Center.

According to Johns Hopkins Hospital literature, “Dr. Carson focuses on traumatic brain injuries, brain and spinal cord tumors, achondroplasia, neurological and congenital disorders, craniosynostosis, epilepsy, and trigeminal neuralgia. He is also interested in maximizing the intellectual potential of every child.”[4]

Carson believes his hand–eye coordination and three-dimensional reasoning skills made him a gifted surgeon.[5] After medical school, he became a neurosurgery resident at Johns Hopkins Hospital in Baltimore. Starting off as an adult neurosurgeon, Carson became more interested in pediatrics. He believed that with children, “what you see is what you get,... when they’re in pain they clearly show it with a frown on their face or when they are happy they show it by smiling brightly.[5]”

In 1987 Carson successfully separated conjoined twins, the Binder twins, who had been joined at the back of the head, making them craniopagus twins. The 50-member surgical team, led by Carson, worked for 22 hours. At the end, the twins were successfully separated and can now survive independently. As Carson said in an interview:

I was talking to a friend of mine, who was a cardiothoracic surgeon, who was the chief of the division, and I said, "You guys operate on the heart in babies, how do you keep them from exsanguinating" and he says, "Well, we put them in hypothermic arrest." I said, "Is there any reason that -- if we were doing a set of Siamese twins that were joined at the head -- that we couldn't put them into hypothermic arrest, at the appropriate time, when we're likely to lose a lot of blood?" and he said, "No." I said, "Wow, this is great." Then I said, "Why am I putting my time into this? I'm not going to see any Siamese twins." So I kind of forgot about it, and lo and behold, two months later, along came these doctors from Germany, presenting this case of Siamese twins. And, I was asked for my opinion, and I then began to explain the techniques that should be used, and how we would incorporate hypothermic arrest, and everybody said "Wow! That sounds like it might work." And, my colleagues and I, a few of us went over to Germany. We looked at the twins. We actually put in scalp expanders, and five months later we brought them over and did the operation, and lo and behold, it worked.[6]

Carson figured in the revival of the hemispherectomy, a drastic surgical procedure in which part or all of one hemisphere of the brain is removed to control severe pediatric epilepsy. He refined the procedure in the 1980s, encouraged by Dr. John M. Freeman,[7] and performed it many times.[8][9]

In addition to his responsibilities at Johns Hopkins, he has served on the boards of the Kellogg Company, Costco, and the Academy of Achievement. He is an emeritus fellow of the Yale Corporation.

In March 2013, Carson announced he would retire as a surgeon, stating “I’d much rather quit when I'm at the top of my game, and there’s so many more things that can be done.”[10] His retirement became official on July 1, with Carson saying he would leave the decision of whether to go into politics “in the hands of God, but much can be done outside the political arena.” [11]
Awards and honors

Carson is a member of the American Academy of Achievement, and the Horatio Alger Association of Distinguished Americans. In 2000 he received the Award for Greatest Public Service Benefiting the Disadvantaged, an award given out annually by Jefferson Awards.[12] In 2008 the White House awarded Carson the Presidential Medal of Freedom, the nation’s highest civilian honor.[13] In 2010, he was elected into the National Academy of Sciences Institute of Medicine.[14] Carson has been awarded 38 honorary doctorate degrees and dozens of national merit citations.[15]
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Post 05 Dec 2014, 9:43 am

rickyp wrote:Pediatric neurosurgeon
fox news contributor
conspiracy theorist
tea party fave...
and committed rhetorical godwin

http://thinkprogress.org/election/2014/ ... -election/

http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/02/politics/ ... -gop-poll/

http://www.newscorpse.com/ncWP/?p=21970


I would hope that in the interest of knowledge and becoming learned, you would at least watch the movie. It is pretty good. At least it shows how he came from a poor background and his growth to what he is today.

Or... Some people can spout off and just quote other people's opinions without personal knowledge...
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Post 05 Dec 2014, 10:21 am

I went and read the moderate entry. First, he admits he is a beneficiary of affirmative action. His life trajectory was changed by his admission to Yale . Same as Clarence Thomas's life was changed. Given his conservative positions, I am wondering what his position on affirmative action is?
He was a prominent surgeon who did a lot of great things for kids. That 's a good thing . Perhaps he should reflect on where he would be without affirmative action. Here are his words about this. http://m.townhall.com/columnists/drbenc ... /page/full

So of course affirmative action is not necessary even though he appears to acknowledge that it got him into Yale and and Michigan Medical School. "Compassionate Action" for everyone. Sure.

Someone described him as Herman Cain without the personal skeletons. They are both black men who did well in their professional careers and they hold conservative views. And their views are unconventional. Sounds about right.

What is it about many white conservatives that makes them love to hear black conservatives with some accomplishment take shots at liberalism? Would a white conservative with Ben Carson's background and political unsophistication have any chance at gaining traction in a presidential race? If not, then this support for Ben Carson does not come from a particularly good place .
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Post 05 Dec 2014, 10:47 am

fate
The Left has chosen to attack him because he's black and has the unmitigated gall not to believe as they think he should

You don't think it might have something to do with his unhinged comparison of the USA to Nazi Germany and other rhetorical gems?
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Post 05 Dec 2014, 11:05 am

rickyp wrote:fate
The Left has chosen to attack him because he's black and has the unmitigated gall not to believe as they think he should

You don't think it might have something to do with his unhinged comparison of the USA to Nazi Germany and other rhetorical gems?


No.

And, I think you're bending his comparison. I don't think it's much different (sans the Nazis) than what Jonathan Turley (a liberal) has said: President Obama is destroying the separation of powers and liberals ought to object to that.
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Post 05 Dec 2014, 12:11 pm

I have not said anything about his positions. I was speaking about the man.

As to the comments about Affirmative Action:
If he were to better himself with Affirmative Action only to be derided for it, why is it a program people would want to use? Isn't that what Affirmative Action is to do? If there was not an Affirmative Action program would that make you happier for Mr. Carson (knowing that he did it by himself) Freeman?
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Post 05 Dec 2014, 1:55 pm

Black conservatives who benefit from affirmative action are placed in an awkward position, no doubt. It is completely fair for liberals to ask that a black conservative who has benefited massively from a liberal social program reconcile that with his conservative beliefs (conservatives do not generally belief in such preferential treatment. ). Ben Carson did well when given the opportunity, but the white or Asian person he most likely replaced at Yale or Michigan Medical School could have done even better, we don't know. He tried to square the circle with his compassionate action proposal--nope, sorry, that won't work .
I think disadvantaged minorities should be given some preference in admissions. And the Ben Carson is a great example of why we should do it. He did well given his circumstances and while he apparently was not as qualified as other Yale students who presumably were provided with greater resources growing up, he eventually caught up. And did very well. With a substantial assist from a liberal program/policy. And then he makes it and he wants to change it so that opportunity is just about class and not race. I think a black conservative who benefits from affirmative action has a tough time of it . Of course, a white conservative on welfare as an adult would have a tough time of it as well. When a person 's life story conflicts with their views...they 're going to get called on it.