freeman3 wrote:Walmart did an internal survey a few years ago that found 86 percent love their jobs (which is laughable because only 47 percent of us employees like their jobs). Here is a discussion if the issue
http://inthesetimes.com/article/14279/d ... rs_them_o/
Also the results of an inspection of Walmart stores. http://www.businessweek.com/stories/200 ... ial-advice

Freeman, why do you think it is ok to work as an intern on your own volition for a pay that you agree to that would be less than minimum wage, but do not accept that other people can make that same choice?

Is there something special about you that permits you to make better choices?

bbauska

The problem is that there are those (RickyP) who thinks everyone should have a "living" wage. I wonder what his opinion on "The Nation" payment policy is.

Unpaid, or underpaid compensation for labour is the same whether or not its Walmart or a media corporation. Its exploitive.
I might make an exception for "institutionalized internships" that are actually extensions of an educational format. Medical schoold students goind on to medical clerking... where they learn and are used as "labour". law clerks too.
However, the use if interns by corporations to fill out the bottom layer without compensating the work is over used and abusive.

Whats the opposite of a living wage Bbauska?

rickyp wrote:bbauska

The problem is that there are those (RickyP) who thinks everyone should have a "living" wage. I wonder what his opinion on "The Nation" payment policy is.

Unpaid, or underpaid compensation for labour is the same whether or not its Walmart or a media corporation. Its exploitive.
I might make an exception for "institutionalized internships" that are actually extensions of an educational format. Medical schoold students goind on to medical clerking... where they learn and are used as "labour". law clerks too.
However, the use if interns by corporations to fill out the bottom layer without compensating the work is over used and abusive.

Whats the opposite of a living wage Bbauska?

It is all a wage. Does a family in Kenya dream about $7.50 an hour? It is all perspective. "living wage" is not my term, hence the quotes,

rickyp wrote:Whats the opposite of a living wage Bbauska?

What is the opposite of Pro-Life, RickyP? Do you really care to try your hand at being a wordsmith? It is not a strong suit for you...

More whataboutery. Kenya has a very different economy, and the purchasing power of $7.50 in the US is very different to the nominal equivalent in Kenya.

Do you think, however, that we could set our standards a little higher than those of the third world?

bbauska

Does a family in Kenya dream about $7.50 an hour?

Ah the American dream.
When you have to compare the life of the working poor in America with the conditions in Third World nations to have a favorable comparison ... don't you think your standards have slipped?

Compare the life of someone in Norway or Germany who earns the minimum wage there with an American on minimum wage ... The insecurities that American working poor face are far greater.
And the opportunities for the children of the working poor in those nations far greater as access to health care, and education allow them a much greater opportunity to move out of their socio ecomic level. (And I think the ability to improve the lives of ones children is the dream of everyone.)

danivon wrote:More whataboutery. Kenya has a very different economy, and the purchasing power of $7.50 in the US is very different to the nominal equivalent in Kenya.

Do you think, however, that we could set our standards a little higher than those of the third world?

I agree that there are many levels of economic life. Even in the US. Why can RickyP compare to Norway and Germany, but it is whataboutery for me to mention Kenya?

I think we can set our personal sights at any level we choose. We can strive too achieve that level also. Alternatively, we can be satisfied with our current strata. It is all personal choice.

and again, what about teenage kids, they make minimum wage, are you suggesting they too should be paid a "living wage"? Yes, those pimple faced McDonalds workers should be paid as if they had families to support. while the price of your hamburger goes up to pay for that ...oh, and you will of course eat fewer now that the cost has risen, so they are going to have to let those people go but no problem, the nanny government will pay them to sit at home and not work!?

Teen-agers working at McDonalds? A lot more immigrants than teen-agers work there from what I can tell. Starbucks or In-N-Out or the local yogurt place--yeah. Suburban white teen-agers are rarely working for McDonalds. Or Burger King or Taco Bell or Del Taco.

freeman3 wrote:Teen-agers working at McDonalds? A lot more immigrants than teen-agers work there from what I can tell. Starbucks or In-N-Out or the local yogurt place--yeah. Suburban white teen-agers are rarely working for McDonalds. Or Burger King or Taco Bell or Del Taco.

How racist a comment is this! My goodness, Freeman. It sounds as if you are saying the non-whites teens are the only ones to work minimum wage. Please explain this.

Norway, Germany and the USA are all developed first world nations with similar standards of living, and similar living costs. So comparisons are more valuable between them than between one of them and a developing nation like Kenya.

Also, it seems to be a paucity of ambition to rank your nation against a Third World country (even though for Africa, Kenya is doing quite well).

bbauska wrote:

freeman3 wrote:Teen-agers working at McDonalds? A lot more immigrants than teen-agers work there from what I can tell. Starbucks or In-N-Out or the local yogurt place--yeah. Suburban white teen-agers are rarely working for McDonalds. Or Burger King or Taco Bell or Del Taco.

How racist a comment is this!

You seem to have used an exclamation mark in place of a question mark there. But the answer is "not much at all"

My goodness, Freeman. It sounds as if you are saying the non-whites teens are the only ones to work minimum wage. Please explain this.

Not sure how you inferred that. He did not talk about 'non-white teens'. He was observing (and he may be extrapolating from limited observation, but still that is not 'racist') that in some chains it is not teens working on minimum wage, but immigrants (no age specified), while in other chains, you do see white suburban teens more often working (not sure if for minimum wage).

If you are going to play the game of crying 'racism' you need better cues than that.

so getting back to the issue of unpaid internships, are they used as frequently in Europe and other developed countries? I have a nephew in his 3rd year of law school and he has had to take a series of unpaid internships even though he is of very modest means. The growth of this practice for people in their mid-20's and older has to be of some concern.

No, I meant an exclamation point, thank you. I was shocked that he would say that suburban white kids do not work at McDonalds, et al. What evidence does Freeman have of that?

Workforce Diversity
Over 9.5 million people worked in restaurants and bars in August of 2011 with 8.6 million working in
non-supervisory positions.

In 2010, 52 percent of these workers were women, 11 percent were African-American, 6 percent were Asian, and 22 percent were Hispanic or Latino.

http://www.aspenwsi.org/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/The-Restaurant-Workforce-in-the-United-States.pdf

How close is that to actual populations in the US?

Ray Jay wrote:so getting back to the issue of unpaid internships, are they used as frequently in Europe and other developed countries? I have a nephew in his 3rd year of law school and he has had to take a series of unpaid internships even though he is of very modest means. The growth of this practice for people in their mid-20's and older has to be of some concern.

Not sure about 'Europe', but in our atypical corner of it, I have seen an increase in it. There have been compaints about unpaid (and un-expensed) internships. It does tend to be for younger people (we tend to start and end university earlier than Americans) than the mid-20s, though.