danivon wrote:What 'hate' are we talking about, here? Steve's quotes are not conclusive as he seems to think, so what examples can you provide, Russell?

Them Jews aren't going to let him talk to me. I told my baby daughter, that he'll talk to me in five years when he's a lame duck, or in eight years when he's out of office."

T]he Jewish vote, the A-I-P-A-C vote, that’s controlling him, that would not let him send representation to the Darfur Review Conference, that’s talking this craziness on this trip, cause they’re Zionists, they would not let him talk to someone who calls a spade what it is

danivon wrote:

Doctor Fate wrote:What's the world's problem? White people.

Umm, no. The problem was 'greed'.

But, wait, there's more:

I bet a site called 'Stop Obama' is going to be balanced!

“We don’t buy into these false divisions here. It’s not about income, Barack. Cops don’t check my bank account when they pull me over and make me spread-eagle against the car. These miseducated brothers, like that sociologist at the University of Chicago, talking about ‘the declining significance of race.’ Now, what country is he living in?”

Are you saying that race is no longer significant in the USA? Or that blacks are disproportionately suspected of crimes?

“Life’s not safe for a black man in this country, Barack. Never has been. Probably never will be.” [201]

Please show us how the murder rate of blacks is the same as that of other races, that'll show us that there's no difference in safety

Afterward, in the parking lot, I sat in my car and thumbed through a silver brochure that I’d picked up in the reception area. It contained a set of guiding principles-a “Black Value System”-that the congregation had adopted in 1979. At the top of the list was a commitment to God, “who will give us the strength to give up prayerful passivism [sic] and become Black Christian activists, soldiers for Black freedom and the dignity of all humankind.” Then a commitment to the black community and black family, education, the work ethic, discipline, and self-respect. . . .

So, umm he's damned by a list headed up by a commitment to God?

By the way, 'passivism' is not misspelled- it's not 'pacifism', but passivenss that is what is being asked to give up.

But I see your point. How dare Wright's church promote education, family, discipline, work ethic, etc. And how dare Obama respect that.

Actually, no I don't see your point.

A sensible, heartfelt list…There was one particular passage in Trinity’s brochure that stood out, though, a commandment more self-conscious in its tone, requiring greater elaboration. “A Disavowal of the Pursuit of Middleclassness,” the heading read. “While it is permissible to chase ‘middleincomeness’ with all our might,” the text stated, those blessed with the talent or good fortune to achieve success in the American mainstream must avoid the “psychological entrapment of Black ‘middleclassness’ that hypnotizes the successful brother or sister into believing they are better than the rest and teaches them to think in terms of ‘we’ and ‘they’ instead of ‘US’!” [202] . . .

Nothing wrong with that either, really. There's the problem of working class people who develop a chip on their shoulder and see all who 'escape' upwards as class traitors. And that's divisive. Then there's the attitude of people who do obtain a better life who look down on their former peers. And that's divisive too.

That the press failed to investigate this doesn't exonerate the Man.

Waah! You need to be spoonfed by the 'press'? Obama wrote this stuff in his autobiography...

And why this 'Man' stuff? Is this another symptom of your obsession?

Archduke Russell John wrote:

danivon wrote:What 'hate' are we talking about, here? Steve's quotes are not conclusive as he seems to think, so what examples can you provide, Russell?

Well, his response to a question about lack of contact between him and Obama in June of 2009 was

Them Jews aren't going to let him talk to me. I told my baby daughter, that he'll talk to me in five years when he's a lame duck, or in eight years when he's out of office."

or his response on why Obama didn't send anybody to the Darfur conference

T]he Jewish vote, the A-I-P-A-C vote, that’s controlling him, that would not let him send representation to the Darfur Review Conference, that’s talking this craziness on this trip, cause they’re Zionists, they would not let him talk to someone who calls a spade what it is

Now I know these are post Obama but when you add that to what was said before, such as an April 2003 comment calling Condi Rice Condaskeeza Rice, would seem to create a pattern of conduct that includes preaching hate.

The government lied about inventing the HIV virus as a means of genocide against people of color. The government lied.

In the 21st century, white America got a wake-up call after 9/11/01. White America and the western world came to realize that people of color had not gone away, faded into the woodwork or just 'disappeared' as the Great White West kept on its merry way of ignoring black concerns.

Doctor Fate wrote:And why this 'Man' stuff? Is this another symptom of your obsession?

Sassenach wrote:Every thrread here runs to pages and pages. Pretty much all the posts worth reading happen in the first 1 or 2 though.

danivon wrote:Well, indeed they are post-Obama. Which means that Obama could not have sat through them in sermons. Perhaps Rev Wright was embittered by something that happened around 4 years ago...

The Condaleeza Rice jibe is nasty, but it's not the same as 'preaching hate'. What 'hate' was he preaching before 2008? That is what I am asking for.

Sen. Barack Obama's pastor says blacks should not sing "God Bless America" but "God damn America."

The Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Obama's pastor for the last 20 years at the Trinity United Church of Christ on Chicago's south side, has a long history of what even Obama's campaign aides concede is "inflammatory rhetoric," including the assertion that the United States brought on the 9/11 attacks with its own "terrorism."

In a campaign appearance earlier this month, Sen. Obama said, "I don't think my church is actually particularly controversial." He said Rev. Wright "is like an old uncle who says things I don't always agree with," telling a Jewish group that everyone has someone like that in their family.

Rev. Wright married Obama and his wife Michelle, baptized their two daughters and is credited by Obama for the title of his book, "The Audacity of Hope."

An ABC News review of dozens of Rev. Wright's sermons, offered for sale by the church, found repeated denunciations of the U.S. based on what he described as his reading of the Gospels and the treatment of black Americans.

"The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people," he said in a 2003 sermon. "God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."

In addition to damning America, he told his congregation on the Sunday after Sept. 11, 2001 that the United States had brought on al Qaeda's attacks because of its own terrorism.


"We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye," Rev. Wright said in a sermon on Sept. 16, 2001.

"We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost," he told his congregation.

Sen. Obama told the New York Times he was not at the church on the day of Rev. Wright's 9/11 sermon. "The violence of 9/11 was inexcusable and without justification," Obama said in a recent interview. "It sounds like he was trying to be provocative," Obama told the paper.

. . .

"I wouldn't call it radical. I call it being black in America," said one congregation member outside the church last Sunday.

"He has impacted the life of Barack Obama so much so that he wants to portray that feeling he got from Rev. Wright onto the country because we all need something positive," said another member of the congregation.

Rev. Wright, who declined to be interviewed by ABC News, is considered one of the country's 10 most influential black pastors, according to members of the Obama campaign.

Obama has praised at least one aspect of Rev. Wright's approach, referring to his "social gospel" and his focus on Africa, "and I agree with him on that."

Sassenach wrote:Trying to discuss British topics here is essentially pointless. I'd be willing to join in, but something tells me the threads would die a fairly speedy death.

Danivon wrote:Steve - you are quoting the stuff from 2008. We already saw it all back then, and that's what the fuss was about back then. I'm not asking for repetition of stuff we've known for years.