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Post 28 Aug 2015, 9:18 am

I'll give you a couple of hours to delete the above "post", DF. Otherwise, I will respond in kind. Your choice.
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Post 28 Aug 2015, 9:38 am

freeman3 wrote:I'll give you a couple of hours to delete the above "post", DF. Otherwise, I will respond in kind. Your choice.


Don't wait.

I didn't go after you. I went after your abuse of logic. Even your own link does not support what you want it to support (huffpo yellow journalistic style notwithstanding).

David Duke is not associated with Trump.

David Duke does not agree with Trump. He wants zero immigration. Trump wants to deport illegal immigrants and then bring back "the good ones." To Duke, there are no good ones.

Duke said Trump was "untrustworthy." Is that an endorsement?

Duke said "Immigration is an existential threat to our people in every way."

Trump is for immigration, but against illegal immigration.

So, I repeat, that Huffpo piece was trash. Period.
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Post 28 Aug 2015, 11:29 am

Deleted.
Last edited by freeman3 on 28 Aug 2015, 1:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post 28 Aug 2015, 11:51 am

Deleted.
Last edited by Doctor Fate on 28 Aug 2015, 2:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post 28 Aug 2015, 1:45 pm

I know you all hate Fox News. All I can say is "Lo siento."

Even so, they have two sources on this story and I'd be concerned if I were a Hillary fan.

A separate source, who also was not authorized to speak on the record, said the FBI will further determine whether Clinton should have known, based on the quality and detail of the material, that emails passing through her server contained classified information regardless of the markings. The campaign's standard defense and that of Clinton is that she "never sent nor received any email that was marked classified" at the time.

It is not clear how the FBI team's findings will impact the probe itself. But the details offer a window into what investigators are looking for -- as the Clinton campaign itself downplays the controversy.

The FBI offered no comment, citing the ongoing investigation.

A leading national security attorney, who recently defended former CIA officer Jeffrey Sterling in a leak investigation, told Fox News that violating the Espionage Act provision in question is a felony and pointed to a particular sub-section.

"Under [sub-section] F, the documents relate to the national defense, meaning very closely held information," attorney Edward MacMahon Jr. explained. "Somebody in the government, with a clearance and need to know, then delivered the information to someone not entitled to receive it, or otherwise moved it from where it was supposed to be lawfully held."

Additional federal regulations, reviewed by Fox News, also bring fresh scrutiny to Clinton's defense.

The Code of Federal Regulations, or "CFR," states: "Any person who has knowledge that classified information has been or may have been lost, possibly compromised or disclosed to an unauthorized person(s) shall immediately report the circumstances to an official designated for this purpose."

A government legal source confirmed the regulations apply to all government employees holding a clearance, and the rules do not make the "send" or "receive" distinction.

Rather, all clearances holders have an affirmative obligation to report the possible compromise of classified information or use of unsecured data systems.


:uhoh:

Uh-oh indeed.
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Post 28 Aug 2015, 1:57 pm

Well, I would much rather debate things than get into personal exchanges. But when words like stupid get thrown around I tend to get a little angry. But my response was over the top so I will delete it.
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Post 28 Aug 2015, 2:16 pm

freeman3 wrote:Well, I would much rather debate things than get into personal exchanges. But when words like stupid get thrown around I tend to get a little angry. But my response was over the top so I will delete it.


Well, again, I never said you were stupid. I know better. I thought the article was awful. So, how about I apologize for offending you and re-characterize the article as "ill-suited" to the purpose for which you intend it?
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Post 31 Aug 2015, 12:04 pm

Clinton's e-mail troubles: " It is a tale...full of sound and fury, signifying nothing"
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStor ... n-33433600
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Post 31 Aug 2015, 1:41 pm

freeman3 wrote:Clinton's e-mail troubles: " It is a tale...full of sound and fury, signifying nothing"
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStor ... n-33433600


1. Because the FBI often conducts investigations for no reason.
2. Because ABC News has no horse in this race . . . *cough* Stephanopoulos.
3. Because of what I posted earlier:

The Code of Federal Regulations, or "CFR," states: "Any person who has knowledge that classified information has been or may have been lost, possibly compromised or disclosed to an unauthorized person(s) shall immediately report the circumstances to an official designated for this purpose."

A government legal source confirmed the regulations apply to all government employees holding a clearance, and the rules do not make the "send" or "receive" distinction.


Now, argue the facts. She received detailed info about world leaders, locations of our ambassadors, etc. She never notified anyone. If she did, that would prove that she lied from the outset about receiving classified info.

4. She's parsing. When a Clinton parses, he/she is lying.
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Post 31 Aug 2015, 1:48 pm

And, apparently, there are going to be 150 classified emails released tonight.

Here's the thing. She was Secretary of State. SHE is supposed to know what is/is not classified. Her only defense is incompetence. And, that's not a defense that will get her elected.
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Post 31 Aug 2015, 3:22 pm

It's just going to be too complicated for the average person to follow. That is why whether there is a criminal investigation and whether that results in an indictment is so important. When voters start weighing things this e-mail thing for non-Republicans is not going to be that big of a factor unless there is a criminal complaint/indictment. Maybe there is now but there is not much else going on now. It's like the Republican race--right now, Trump and Dr Carson are getting support. Why? It's a protest vote. Republican voters unhappy with the Republican establishment are expressing their dissatisfaction. But there is no way one of those two get the nomination because most of that support is thin and will go to other candidates when the time comes (and other candidates modify their platform to appeal to those dissatisfied voters). So while Hillary is getting hurt by the e-mail scandal now it won't be as big of a deal later when Democratic voters have to make binding decisions . Unless she gets charged.
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Post 31 Aug 2015, 4:51 pm

freeman3 wrote:It's just going to be too complicated for the average person to follow. That is why whether there is a criminal investigation and whether that results in an indictment is so important. When voters start weighing things this e-mail thing for non-Republicans is not going to be that big of a factor unless there is a criminal complaint/indictment.


You may be right. However, as the emails containing classified info gets into the hundreds, I think it will be difficult to ignore. And, if there is one, even one, that can be turned into an ad for the fall . . . watch out.

Maybe there is now but there is not much else going on now. It's like the Republican race--right now, Trump and Dr Carson are getting support. Why? It's a protest vote.


True, but Hillary has lost 1/3 of her support in Iowa. She's at 37%. If she starts getting those numbers nationally, I think the DNC starts looking for a new knight.

Republican voters unhappy with the Republican establishment are expressing their dissatisfaction. But there is no way one of those two get the nomination because most of that support is thin and will go to other candidates when the time comes (and other candidates modify their platform to appeal to those dissatisfied voters).


Maybe, but there is a LOT of dissatisfaction. I think Iowa is a done deal for the rebels. If the establishment is going to rally, it will have to be in South Carolina or Florida. I can't see Trump losing NH and I would think he'll be strong in NV too--unless he implodes. Iowa, I think, goes to Carson. Then again, Iowa often picks an also-ran.

So while Hillary is getting hurt by the e-mail scandal now it won't be as big of a deal later when Democratic voters have to make binding decisions . Unless she gets charged.


I've said it before and I'll say it again: if we have to have a Democrat, I'd like it to be someone who is not a known liar. That word cloud for Hillary is one she has earned.
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Post 01 Sep 2015, 9:08 am

Fate
And, apparently, there are going to be 150 classified emails released tonight


Yes. Big Hairy deal. The kind of stuff that sometimes gets "classified" is ridiculous.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/na ... story.html
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Post 01 Sep 2015, 9:20 am

That fact that whether or not something gets classified is not the issue. The issue is that if the document or email is classified, do you follow the laws governing the custodianship of classified material?

Just because someone does not think a document "should" be classified, doesn't make it unclassified and exempt from security protocol.
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Post 01 Sep 2015, 9:24 am

rickyp wrote:Fate
And, apparently, there are going to be 150 classified emails released tonight


Yes. Big Hairy deal. The kind of stuff that sometimes gets "classified" is ridiculous.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/na ... story.html


Something is ridiculous--your assertions.

Understand this: email containing information about other governments, negotiations, and even the location of Ambassador Stevens was classified the moment it was written. Part of Hillary's job as Secretary of State was to understand that. SHE was responsible to report any classified info she received that was not properly marked. That was her job! Failing to do that was a violation of the law and, certainly, a sign of either malfeasance or incompetence. Take your pick.