Doctor Fate wrote:Jeb is pathetic.

It appears Trump is unraveling.

Sassenach wrote:

It appears Trump is unraveling.

A number of people whose opinion I normally respect have maintained all along that Trump never had any intention of actually winning and that part of the reason he keeps being so outrageous is that he wants to give himself an excuse to drop out. Maybe his high polling numbers are making him desperate ?

dag hammarsjkold wrote:Fate,

I owe you a lunch.

Dag

freeman3 wrote:Trump takes a hit nationally.http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/268 ... ional-poll

But still holds a commanding lead in New Hampshire.
http://nypost.com/2016/02/04/trump-sand ... hire-poll/

Rubio is a single issue candidate who would continue to isolate Cuba, thus mirror the prevailing attitude prevalent in the Floridian Hispanic community, but not the rest of the US. His policy is a continuation of Cold War mentalities that are motivated by these attitudes:
1. Revenge aimed by that community at the Castros for the events of the 1950's.
2. Hopes of recovering lost assets by maintaining hopes the US will overthrow the Castros through economic sanctions that thus far have only held Cuba back, not actually succeeding in causing the demise of the Castros.

If one extends the mentality driving these attitudes, nothing short of military invasion would suit them. Whereas, these single-minded supporters of Rubio (and duped advocates) are refusing to see that releasing Cuba from its financial straits would likely draw Cuba into the US economic sphere of influence post-Castro, and help to avoid the chaos that is likely to ensue (and the refugee/asylum) issues that are forthcoming when both Fidel and Raul Castro are gone and the island erupts into a political (possibly bloody) free-for-all among remaining warlords.

Should that happen, the US may be forced to interfere militarily if only to defend its Guantanamo base (not the prison) and its residents. Again, that's what the Floridian Hispanic community may want and see in Rubio, but the rest of the country would not if they correspondingly listen closely to Rubio's speeches and interviews yesterday as well as today.

I have no objection per se to a Hispanic president, but I dislike this idea of voting for candidates by race rather than by perceived competence. Rubio's time is post-Castro, not now. He can then focus on national needs and not strictly Floridian Hispanic prejudices.

Sassenach wrote:This is an interesting angle on Rubio that was posted by a friend of mine at another forum I frequent. He's a middle class American approaching retirement whose views are broadly conservative and who typically votes Republican more often than not (although not all the time, and he's very critical of the Tea Party crowd). It's a view that I've not seen repeated elsewhere, but he's frequently very perceptive about American politics so I'm disinclined to dismiss it. I'd be interested to see if it chimes with anybody here:

Rubio is a single issue candidate who would continue to isolate Cuba, thus mirror the prevailing attitude prevalent in the Floridian Hispanic community, but not the rest of the US. His policy is a continuation of Cold War mentalities that are motivated by these attitudes:
1. Revenge aimed by that community at the Castros for the events of the 1950's.
2. Hopes of recovering lost assets by maintaining hopes the US will overthrow the Castros through economic sanctions that thus far have only held Cuba back, not actually succeeding in causing the demise of the Castros.

If one extends the mentality driving these attitudes, nothing short of military invasion would suit them. Whereas, these single-minded supporters of Rubio (and duped advocates) are refusing to see that releasing Cuba from its financial straits would likely draw Cuba into the US economic sphere of influence post-Castro, and help to avoid the chaos that is likely to ensue (and the refugee/asylum) issues that are forthcoming when both Fidel and Raul Castro are gone and the island erupts into a political (possibly bloody) free-for-all among remaining warlords.

Should that happen, the US may be forced to interfere militarily if only to defend its Guantanamo base (not the prison) and its residents. Again, that's what the Floridian Hispanic community may want and see in Rubio, but the rest of the country would not if they correspondingly listen closely to Rubio's speeches and interviews yesterday as well as today.

I have no objection per se to a Hispanic president, but I dislike this idea of voting for candidates by race rather than by perceived competence. Rubio's time is post-Castro, not now. He can then focus on national needs and not strictly Floridian Hispanic prejudices.

freeman3 wrote:Talk about pathetic. Jeb went running for Mom.
http://www.esquire.com/news-politics/ne ... interview/

I am speechless.

However, I've seen nothing to suggest Rubio would favor an invasion. I think your friend is a bit paranoid. Something may change when the Castros die, but it may not. The Soviets manages to transfer power and not change the central government structure--until it collapsed. I suspect Raul has a plan.

Sassenach wrote:

However, I've seen nothing to suggest Rubio would favor an invasion. I think your friend is a bit paranoid. Something may change when the Castros die, but it may not. The Soviets manages to transfer power and not change the central government structure--until it collapsed. I suspect Raul has a plan.

His point, I think, is that continued isolation of Cuba suits the narrow interests of the Florida latino community but is not in the national interest of the US, and that Rubio is too closely aligned with that community. The invasion thing is probably hyperbole, but the point is still a valid one.

Doctor Fate wrote:As far as most Americans are concerned, the only victims of the Castros are the Cuban people. If Rubio reinstates some trade restrictions, maybe he'll actually leverage something from them.

I know. It sounds absurd after 8 years of asking our enemies what else we can give them in return for nothing, but it might work.

danivon wrote:

Doctor Fate wrote:As far as most Americans are concerned, the only victims of the Castros are the Cuban people. If Rubio reinstates some trade restrictions, maybe he'll actually leverage something from them.

I know. It sounds absurd after 8 years of asking our enemies what else we can give them in return for nothing, but it might work.

Sorry, but the preceding 50 years of sanctions against Cuba achieved what for the Cuban people, exactly?

Reinstating sanctions without some indication that Cuba has reneged on agreements would show the USA to be untrustworthy. And would also damage your reputation with other nations, including your allies.

I suspect in reality most Americans are not really all that concerned about Cuba at all. I can't think of any other immigrant group in the US that has anywhere near as much influence on foreign policy and especially the attitude towards the government of their former homeland, except perhaps the Jewish-Israel lobby, but there's a lot more to that and most of those did not come to the US from Israel.