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- geojanes
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26 Mar 2013, 1:30 pm
Doctor Fate wrote:Don't you realize you denied the country economic benefits by getting off unemployment early? According to Pelosi and other Democrats, unemployment is one of the best ways to stimulate the economy.
You should be ashamed of yourself!
Boo, thread hijacking! And also intellectually dishonest, as no one anywhere has ever said that staying on unemployment is better for the economy than a job.
On topic, should I assume you agree with Art Laffer?
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- Doctor Fate
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26 Mar 2013, 2:49 pm
geojanes wrote:Doctor Fate wrote:Don't you realize you denied the country economic benefits by getting off unemployment early? According to Pelosi and other Democrats, unemployment is one of the best ways to stimulate the economy.
You should be ashamed of yourself!
Boo, thread hijacking! And also intellectually dishonest, as no one anywhere has ever said that staying on unemployment is better for the economy than a job.
No one other than Nancy Pelosi:
"Let me say that unemployment insurance… is one of the biggest stimuluses (sic) to our economy. Economists will tell you, this money is spent quickly. It injects demand into the economy, and it’s job creating. It creates jobs faster than almost any other initiative you can name."
I didn't hijack it; I was merely scolding the Archduke for doing the unpatriotic thing!
On topic, should I assume you agree with Art Laffer?
Laffer does not simply favor lowering deductions. He has a bigger overhaul in mind.
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- Archduke Russell John
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26 Mar 2013, 5:56 pm
geojanes wrote:While this was the first time I heard this argument, it was like an light bulb. Forget the rates: it's a complete red herring to get people to argue about an issue that doesn't matter. It's the concept of realizing gains that's the problem. If your holding period is "forever," as Buffett likes to say, those gains are not realized in your lifetime, and with excellent estate planning, never realized, so never taxed. A tax rate of of six 1/100th of 1 percent sounds pretty tiny, especially when juxtaposed against the Archduke who spent most of the year on unemployment, yet paid a rate 163 times this new Buffett rate.
Uhm., didn't the Republicans just run a Presidential campaign essentially arguing this issue? i.e. don't focus raise taxes rates. Rather reform the tax code. Broaden the base and get rid of deductions. I am pretty sure that is what the party platform was.
Also, I pulled up my tax return, we paid 8.9% this year.
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- geojanes
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26 Mar 2013, 7:22 pm
Top line, yes, but I don't think they reached down to changing how income is counted, at least as I heard. Moving from realized gains to mark-to-market is pretty radical when it comes to personal income tax. The Republican messaging I heard was that everyone should pay something, not Warren Buffett and his ilk should pay a boatload more.
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- danivon
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27 Mar 2013, 7:06 am
Indeed, it was certainly in the rhetoric that too many people paid no taxes (the 47% thing) and that the rich should be left alone as they already pay enough and create jobs (no explanation as to how).
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- geojanes
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27 Mar 2013, 7:15 pm
I'm still not done with my taxes (waiting for one more form) but when I am I'll post my rate as well.
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- Doctor Fate
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28 Mar 2013, 9:30 am
geojanes wrote:I'm still not done with my taxes (waiting for one more form) but when I am I'll post my rate as well.
Hard for me to say what my rate is: do you want the rate based on gross or adjusted income? My adjusted income puts me in the Food Stamp zone. Seriously, I bet I could qualify.
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- geojanes
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28 Mar 2013, 11:27 am
To be consistent, calculate your effective tax rate by taking your total Federal Tax and divide it by your Adjusted Gross Income or AGI.
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- bbauska
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28 Mar 2013, 1:21 pm
Can we agree that this is not the total tax liability? Shouldn't we add the property tax, sales tax, state tax to find a more accurate representation of personal tax liability?
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- Doctor Fate
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28 Mar 2013, 1:28 pm
geojanes wrote:To be consistent, calculate your effective tax rate by taking your total Federal Tax and divide it by your Adjusted Gross Income or AGI.
My return is so complicated, I don't even understand it. Thankfully, I can find the AGI. However, I can't find the Tax line. I see what I pay the State, my SSI payments, etc., but I can't find the Federal Tax line.
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- danivon
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28 Mar 2013, 2:49 pm
Bbauska - A better comparison would be both, as Federal tax can be compared regardless of State.
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- geojanes
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28 Mar 2013, 3:06 pm
bbauska wrote:Can we agree that this is not the total tax liability? Shouldn't we add the property tax, sales tax, state tax to find a more accurate representation of personal tax liability?
I was focusing on Federal, because that's a policy that impacts all of us. I'm sure I pay much higher state and local taxes (4% NY City income tax! To say nothing of the State cut), but I also get a lot more in services (I haven't had to own a car in 16 years). But federal tax and benefits are much less dependent on local issues and differences.
Last edited by
geojanes on 28 Mar 2013, 3:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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- geojanes
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28 Mar 2013, 3:48 pm
Doctor Fate wrote:My return is so complicated, I don't even understand it. Thankfully, I can find the AGI. However, I can't find the Tax line. I see what I pay the State, my SSI payments, etc., but I can't find the Federal Tax line.
On Form 1040 from 2011 (haven't done 2012 yet) it's on line 61 on page 2 and says:
"61 Add lines 55 through 60. This is your total tax" I imagine that 2012 1040 will be in a similar place and use similar language.
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29 Mar 2013, 7:12 am
geojanes wrote:To be consistent, calculate your effective tax rate by taking your total Federal Tax and divide it by your Adjusted Gross Income or AGI.
29.5%
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- geojanes
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30 Mar 2013, 9:53 am
Holy cow! That's huge!
