Oh, and....

Doctor Fate wrote:I have to say that Court is, with all "due" respect, full of it. The clear wording of the bill is in contradiction to what the Court claimed. It's just shocking that the judge was appointed by Bill Clinton, the man who wanted to debate the meaning of the word "is."

Well, perhaps you didn't notice it, what with me writing it, and you quoting it, but I also pointed out:
[quote="danivon"I understand that the plaintiffs are seeking appeal. Until then, it seems that the question is not settled.[/quote]

So, umm, we'll see as and when an appeal is heard whether this judge was 'full of it', or you are.

geojanes wrote:

Doctor Fate wrote:Well, except for those killed by them.

A comment that is beneath you. When you say stuff like that you convince no one, indeed, you make suspect everything you say.

Please. I'm sure you would feel exactly the same way if those were your kids.

Here's the issue: we have laws and the President doesn't enforce them. According to some folks, he is in no way responsible for the consequences of his inaction. I don't agree.

We are told that once immigrants come "out of the shadows" they will call the police, etc. That is NOT what happened with this incident, is it?

Now, it is true that one incident is not enough to invalidate a policy. So, how many incidents would?

Of course, it only gets "better." Apparently, Obama is now looking at granting asylum to some who are only tangentially involved in terrorism.

Terrific.

danivon wrote:Oh, and....

Doctor Fate wrote:I have to say that Court is, with all "due" respect, full of it. The clear wording of the bill is in contradiction to what the Court claimed. It's just shocking that the judge was appointed by Bill Clinton, the man who wanted to debate the meaning of the word "is."

Well, perhaps you didn't notice it, what with me writing it, and you quoting it, but I also pointed out:
[quote="danivon"I understand that the plaintiffs are seeking appeal. Until then, it seems that the question is not settled.

So, umm, we'll see as and when an appeal is heard whether this judge was 'full of it', or you are.[/quote]

No, I saw it. The only question is whether or not the bill actually means what it says or whether it means what a judge wants it to mean.

Doctor Fate wrote:

geojanes wrote:

Doctor Fate wrote:Well, except for those killed by them.

A comment that is beneath you. When you say stuff like that you convince no one, indeed, you make suspect everything you say.

Please. I'm sure you would feel exactly the same way if those were your kids.

Doubling down on the emotional blackmail. Classy.

But if they were my kids, I'd be wracked with guilt over not stopping them from playing in the road. Perhaps I might find it hard to accept that, and use displacement as a way to avoid dealing with the guilt.

Doctor Fate wrote:No, I saw it. The only question is whether or not the bill actually means what it says or whether it means what a judge wants it to mean.

Even if that judge is applying precedent from 30 years ago? Even if he's citing (as the IRS did) definitions of the terms used as applied in the law? Even if what it says in general terms is that it applies to everyone?

I will watch the appeal with interest.

danivon wrote:But if they were my kids, I'd be wracked with guilt over not stopping them from playing in the road. Perhaps I might find it hard to accept that, and use displacement as a way to avoid dealing with the guilt.

Blaming the victims.

Classy.

danivon wrote:

Doctor Fate wrote:No, I saw it. The only question is whether or not the bill actually means what it says or whether it means what a judge wants it to mean.

Even if that judge is applying precedent from 30 years ago? Even if he's citing (as the IRS did) definitions of the terms used as applied in the law? Even if what it says in general terms is that it applies to everyone?

I will watch the appeal with interest.

Gee, me too.

Doctor Fate wrote:

danivon wrote:But if they were my kids, I'd be wracked with guilt over not stopping them from playing in the road. Perhaps I might find it hard to accept that, and use displacement as a way to avoid dealing with the guilt.

Blaming the victims.

Classy.

No, I'm not blaming anyone (I defer to your talents in that regard). I was trying to put myself into the position of the parents, and genuinely think about what I would be feeling.

However, as you asked what someone would feel if it were their kids, I figured perhaps I would find out what they did think. The mother forgave her, and didn't want her to spend any more time in prison, accepting her apology. The story includes video from the court case where both are in tears. It seems that the other parents involved agreed.

http://koin.com/2014/01/31/no-prison-fo ... e-hit-run/

If they don't blame the driver, why would they care if the driver was deported? More to the point, why do you care?

danivon wrote:

Doctor Fate wrote:

danivon wrote:But if they were my kids, I'd be wracked with guilt over not stopping them from playing in the road. Perhaps I might find it hard to accept that, and use displacement as a way to avoid dealing with the guilt.

Blaming the victims.

Classy.

No, I'm not blaming anyone (I defer to your talents in that regard). I was trying to put myself into the position of the parents, and genuinely think about what I would be feeling.

However, as you asked what someone would feel if it were their kids, I figured perhaps I would find out what they did think. The mother forgave her, and didn't want her to spend any more time in prison, accepting her apology. The story includes video from the court case where both are in tears. It seems that the other parents involved agreed.

http://koin.com/2014/01/31/no-prison-fo ... e-hit-run/

If they don't blame the driver, why would they care if the driver was deported? More to the point, why do you care?

In our country, felony hit and run is seen as "bad." Maybe it's just fine in Great Britain.

In California, they have a "solution." Because illegal aliens tend not to have licenses, they are involved in many more hit and run situations. The solution? Give them licenses! That will solve everything! http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2012/10/ ... ate-in-la/

Google this and notice all the different locales: illegal immigrant hit and run

So basically you know better than the families.

danivon wrote:So basically you know better than the families.

Hey, no reason to keep her in prison. It's not like she killed anyone . . .

Technically, the crime has nothing to do with the act that lead to the death of the children. Her driving was not the issue with regard to criminality--it was her leaving the scene, which did not impact whether the kids lived or not. It seems odd, therefore, for you to say she killed them. Maybe you're saying we should deport them , these Dream Act exceptions, because they are bad drivers...

freeman3 wrote:Technically, the crime has nothing to do with the act that lead to the death of the children. Her driving was not the issue with regard to criminality--it was her leaving the scene, which did not impact whether the kids lived or not. It seems odd, therefore, for you to say she killed them. Maybe you're saying we should deport them , these Dream Act exceptions, because they are bad drivers...

Technically, they'd be alive if they had not been struck by a car . . . that she was driving.

But, the King, er, the President, is doing worse than that. He's changing more immigration laws, so now we'll have a few more terrorists welcomed into the US.

Doctor Fate wrote:

danivon wrote:So basically you know better than the families.

Hey, no reason to keep her in prison. It's not like she killed anyone . . .

I repeat: Accident.

I love how you can see a tragedy, a car accident, and come to the totally reasonable and unbiased position that it is Obama's fault.

On the terrorist thing, the US has let terrorists in for years (IRA, Latin anti-left, etc). So which ones are you moaning about now?

fate

Technically, they'd be alive if they had not been struck by a car . . . that she was driving.

The children were hidden under a pile of leaves in the road....
Eventually they were going to be hit by a vehicle.
This poor woman was just unlucky her vehicle came along before another vehicle or before someone supervising the children had them move off the road. (You say we can't blame the victims, or their parents, but really it was their incredibly dangerous behaviour that caused the accident isn't it?)
Her crime was not reporting the accident once she became aware that she had hit someone. And yes that may have been due to her status as an illegal immigrant. But maybe not...
Thousands of legal immigrants and natural born citizens fail to report hit and runs every day. What do you suppose causes them to make this decision?

Why you choose to focus on this particular incident is bizarre. As an illustration of the problems with immigration it achieves nothing...

The only thing that the story seems to illustrate is the incredible power of understanding and forgiveness. As a professed Christian I would have thought that element is was what you might focus upon...