the access of being the son of a governor

Forced to live in govenrment housing....

geojanes wrote:What do you mean DF? Those are the words Romney said. In context, he was talking about giving away his inheritance, but I think Kristof's point still makes sense. The education his father paid for, the access of being the son of a governor and corporate chief executive is surely a big part of how he got where he is today. Or are you saying that stuff doesn't make any difference?

Romney gave away his inheritance.

His dad made his own fortune, after being born in Mexico and coming to US as a less than privileged man. In fact, he never, that I know of, went to college. Romney should not be confused with the Kennedys.

If you want to compare biographies and how each candidate obtained his wealth, I think that would be great. I'm more open to that than the President, I can promise you that.

His dad was a remarkable man for sure, but all Romney did was give away his inheritance. Considering his parents didn't die until the mid/late 90s, when Mitt was already a very wealthy man, I'm not sure how big of a deal that was.

Romney went to the most exclusive prep school in the Detroit area, college at Stanford, Harvard Business/Law, father of a governor, cabinet member, candidate for president, president of American Motors. To quote an more eloquent man than I, you've got to have some brass to call yourself a self-made man in that circumstance.

But, again, I wouldn't be surprised if he realizes that and he was just playing to his audience.

(How did George Romeny run for president in '68 even when he wasn't born in the US? Have to look that up.)

Doctor Fate wrote:

geojanes wrote:But ultimately it does come down to specifics and part of why Romney is messing up so badly is that he doesn't really believe strongly in anything political; he has no conviction, no faith, so he can sound so tone-deaf. He's really messing up his moment.

I think this is right.

I'm surprised to see Romney's strongest defender here agreeing that he has no strong political beliefs, convictions, or faith. Please, DF, correct me ASAP if I'm misinterpreting you.

You cause me to ask myself for which theoretical candidate I'd rather vote: one who is in it purely as an ego trip but promises to pursue policies I think might work best, or one who's an idealist and who really wants to help people but has policy ideas I think are duds? I'm not sure I know how to answer that question. It's not exactly (or even very close to) the one I'm facing with Obama vs. Romney, but it's one raised in my mind by you and Geojanes, and one which might put a different perspective on even this election for me.

It's said that when it comes to being President, character counts. But which aspects of character are most important?

geojanes wrote:(How did George Romeny run for president in '68 even when he wasn't born in the US? Have to look that up.)

You made me curious.

...his birth in a Mormon colony in Mexico drew questions as to whether he was constitutionally eligible to run for president. [It] was a potentially serious problem for Romney. While he was born of American parents and became an American citizen at birth, legal scholars argued back and forth throughout his presidential campaign whether that was enough to meet the constitutional requirement of being a "natural born citizen." Romney and his advisors insisted that it did, but the issue was never definitively resolved before he quit the race.

From HERE, having traced my way from Wikipedia. Not much of an answer, is it?

Purple wrote:

Doctor Fate wrote:

geojanes wrote:But ultimately it does come down to specifics and part of why Romney is messing up so badly is that he doesn't really believe strongly in anything political; he has no conviction, no faith, so he can sound so tone-deaf. He's really messing up his moment.

I think this is right.

I'm surprised to see Romney's strongest defender here agreeing that he has no strong political beliefs, convictions, or faith. Please, DF, correct me ASAP if I'm misinterpreting you.

To be clear in my initial comment, I'm sure Romney has faith and convictions in things like God, his family, important stuff like that, but I believe the doesn't have any strong convictions or faith in a political ideology, which is why he's so flexible. And I don't mean that as a criticism.

Purple wrote:Not much of an answer, is it?

Yeah, it's telling how times have changed.

Ray Jay wrote:I'm just wondering how many posters on Redscape are part of the 53%.

I'm guessing more than 53%. Does that mean most of us are voting for Romney?

geojanes wrote:To be clear in my initial comment, I'm sure Romney has faith and convictions in things like God, his family, important stuff like that, but I believe the doesn't have any strong convictions or faith in a political ideology, which is why he's so flexible. And I don't mean that as a criticism.

I think he is a businessman with somewhat conservative leanings. If he can bring a modicum of efficiency to the military and other Federal programs chock full of waste, we could see substantial savings there. Obama promised to do this and did precious little. One would hope that Romney's background in making companies more efficient would help.

I think his action on the fiat imposition of gay marriage by the Supreme Judicial Court is telling. He did not campaign against it.

As much as the Left has tried to make him Pat Robertson, a cursory examination of the facts will disprove that.

geojanes wrote:

Ray Jay wrote:I'm just wondering how many posters on Redscape are part of the 53%.

I'm guessing more than 53%. Does that mean most of us are voting for Romney?

Quite a lot of the '47%' vote Republican. I would be in the '53%' with my salary in the USA, and there's no way I'd vote for Romney if it was a choice that I had.

Of course the '47%' is notional, because it refers to the high-point, at the worst year of the recession. It's probably lower now.

I have no idea whether I'd fall within income tax in the States or just end up paying payroll taxes instead because i don't know exactly how the system works. I'm not so sure it's a valid distinction though, and in any case I'm a public sector employee so Romney would almost certainly see me as part of the 47% no matter what my tax rate turned out to be.

I wouldn't vote for Romney either btw, but that's more to do with my complete lack of respect for him as a candidate for high office. There have been Republicans in the past who I'd have voted for, and I'm sure there will be again once they shake off the yoke of the extremists.

danivon wrote:

geojanes wrote:

Ray Jay wrote:I'm just wondering how many posters on Redscape are part of the 53%.

I'm guessing more than 53%. Does that mean most of us are voting for Romney?

Quite a lot of the '47%' vote Republican.

Right, which is one of many reasons that partial quote is overblown.

Any comment about the President lying a bout a terror attack?

About Obama calling the first murder of an American ambassador in 33 years a "bump in the road?"

About calling Netanyahu "noise?"

No, DF, because they are off-topic. Start a new thread to exercise your venting about Obama. Or just add to the ones you already started.

By the way, why do you keep going on about 'partial'? Mother Jones released all of the video they had which may be missing 2 minutes, but does run to a lot longer and does not isolate the quote.

Doctor Fate wrote:Romney gave away his inheritance.

Sure, but some time before that, his father gave him enough AMC stock to be able to be a full-time student, without he or Ann needing to work. Estimates of the value of that are about $60k in 1969 dollars (close to $400k in today's money). It's quite a privilege to have your tuition, housing and board (and that of your family) paid for. He didn't need the inheritance by the time it came, but that doesn't mean he did not benefit from parental largess.

George Romney was indeed pretty self-made, but when he stood to be a Presidential candidate he released 12 years of tax returns. I don't think he'd have been quite as disparaging about the poor as his son either (but perhaps someone will prove me wrong).

The candidate who a few weeks ago was talking about healing divisions can't be expected to get a free pass when he says he's not interested in nearly half of the country.

danivon

George Romney was indeed pretty self-made, but when he stood to be a Presidential candidate he released 12 years of tax returns. I don't think he'd have been quite as disparaging about the poor as his son either (but perhaps someone will prove me wrong).

George Romney's father, on the other hand, returned from Mexico and was on welfare assistance for a time.