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- Doctor Fate
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11 Nov 2016, 12:56 pm
freeman3 wrote:Well, Republicans refused to trade with Obama (or allow individual members to do so). If Republicans are willing to horse trade then things can get done. If it's "if you do things we want we will support it but we'll oppose everything else as a bloc" then gridlock will continue. If individual Republican members are allowed to prioritize what they do and don't want and agree to support things they don't want in return for something they want more then things can get done. Democrats are not going to oppose Trump as a bloc like the Republicans opposed Obama if he agrees to do some things they want done. I have no doubt about that. The question is whether Republicans are more flexible than they were with Obama.
That is totally backward.
Obama refused to make deals. He had a "grand bargain" with Boehner, then asked for more.
Read Woodward's book. Obama was inflexible. Biden could make a deal; Obama had the "I won" strategy of politics.
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- GMTom
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11 Nov 2016, 1:00 pm
Freeman, you are sounding pretty horrible of late. Racist remarks, Obamacare being sacrosanct, now you actually want to see the country suffer. If anything, while not happy your gal didn't win, you could at least be happy it was not a "real" Republican?
I gave Obama plenty of chances, I knew Obamacare was a mess and it was but I did see some good in it. I wanted them to continue to work on the idea, but noooo, they forced it down our throats. Similar to your position now, Democrats don't want what is best for the country, they want it their way. Sorry, but that is the position you and your compatriots are painting yourselves as.
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- Doctor Fate
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11 Nov 2016, 1:01 pm
freeman3 wrote:If they can do it without a single Democratic vote then why not do it? I think it's going to be a nightmare issue for them. Businesses are not going to like health coverage bring upset again, health insurance companies are not going to like having to insure people they don't want to insure (like pre-existing conditions) without health people being forced to buy the plan. You are going to have powerful interests opposed to getting rid of it. If they're smart they will keep it but make a deal with the Democrats to restructure it more to their liking. Trying to gut it and getting agreement on a plan that would enable health insurance companies to be able to survive complying with taking bad risks while not getting young, healthy people to make up for that is going to be extraordinarily difficult. The problem is you can't just throw out the bad and take the good--you have to throw out the whole thing. THAT would be very, very unpopular. And of course they can't get totally get rid of Obamacare.
I think I am going to enjoy seeing the Republicans tie themselves in knots over this. All that health insurance money, pharmaceutical money threatening to go over to Democrats; Republican governors who took Medicaid expansion not happy, businesses not happy at things thrown into uncertainly and upsetting what they are doing with health coverage again after finally adjusting to Obamacare. Go ahead...take the hot potato!
They will find a way. Here's one--remove funding for Obamacare, then propose and pass a different plan.
I know, I know. Democrats will never cooperate. Well, wait. How many Senators are in swing states and up for election in 2018? It seems like they might not want to vote to continue the ACA if the GOP puts up a plan that covers pre-existing conditions, etc.
How many Senators will die on the ACA hill? My guess is not many are that brave.
Consider: in each of the last three elections when Obama was not on the ballot (2016, 2014, 2010), what happened? The Republicans did much better than expected. If the ACA is such a wonderful program, why is that?
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- freeman3
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11 Nov 2016, 1:27 pm
I guess we will see if the Democrats have any party discipline. This is a core issue for the base. If Democrats are unwilling to fight for issues that the base cares deeply about...I don't know what to say. Sometimes you have to draw a line in the sand and say there and no further.
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- freeman3
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11 Nov 2016, 1:42 pm
Sure, like Boehner could sell any deal to the Tea Party nuts...
Tom, I like you but when you start to casually make these accusations of racism and I want the country harmed and I dont want to cooperate at all on reforming Obamacare I strenuously deny that and you are misinterpreting what I say. You can disagree with me but throwing conclusory allegations around based on your filtered and mistaken interpretation of what I say is, well, annoying to say the least. If you make those kinds of allegations you should come to the party with supporting evidence. And you don't have because I did nothing that you say I did.
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- Doctor Fate
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11 Nov 2016, 7:41 pm
freeman3 wrote:I guess we will see if the Democrats have any party discipline. This is a core issue for the base. If Democrats are unwilling to fight for issues that the base cares deeply about...I don't know what to say. Sometimes you have to draw a line in the sand and say there and no further.
Those principles will be oh-so-valuable as the GOP goes to 60 Senators or more in 2018!
Yes, play scorched earth for the ACA!
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- freeman3
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11 Nov 2016, 8:45 pm
Trump is already backing off a bit on getting rid of Obamacare....
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.co ... ent=safariYou didn't take all that stuff he said literally, did you?
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- danivon
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12 Nov 2016, 11:43 am
Interesting, as this now looks more like reform than "repeal and replace".
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- Doctor Fate
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12 Nov 2016, 12:20 pm
Let me know what happens when he actually takes office. I'm not worried.
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- GMTom
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14 Nov 2016, 8:56 am
Because he thinks a few parts of Obamacare were good he is now in favor of keeping it? No, he likes those parts (as do many of us) and in the new plan, those will be included.
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- geojanes
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14 Nov 2016, 11:19 am
His interview with 60 Minutes was pretty good. The exact right tone, I thought. Who knew that Trump could be both humble and dignified?
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- GMTom
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14 Nov 2016, 11:32 am
It's REALLY early on now but everything he has done and said so far has been pretty good. Well, ONE big mistake so far, his choice of Bannon as an adviser was a big miss, if he wants to paint himself as in the middle and non-racist, etc he should steer clear of this guy.
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- Ray Jay
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14 Nov 2016, 1:05 pm
GMTom wrote:It's REALLY early on now but everything he has done and said so far has been pretty good. Well, ONE big mistake so far, his choice of Bannon as an adviser was a big miss, if he wants to paint himself as in the middle and non-racist, etc he should steer clear of this guy.
I agree that it was a skilled interview. He's trying to keep both the Establishment and the Tea Party types happy. He can use them both as a lever against the other. If he abandons his Tea Party supporters right away there will be a backlash quicker then they can say Hillary is a crook.
Something very interesting from the interview: he will use his twitter account to go directly to the people: if the House or Senate is not cooperating he may get nasty with one or two. Same goes if the media lens is different then his own. It used to be that Presidents went directly to the people via the radio, and then T.V. Now it's twitter.
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- GMTom
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14 Nov 2016, 1:12 pm
I can't recall who said this but someone was asked what he would recommend to Trump regarding Twitter. his reply was actually pretty good, something to the effect he should use it sparingly and always use an editor!
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- geojanes
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23 Nov 2016, 7:04 am
Conversation starter for tomorrow's holiday feast:
"President Donald J. Trump."
It's all you need to say to get a conversation going. No more awkward silences!
