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There is an entire world out there

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Snake IV
Emissary

Tue Jun 26, 2007 7:30 am

Latest update of the variant development:
Gobble-Earth or Mondial
0: All rule of Diplomacy apply except as stated below.
1: The map is as shown here. For starting positions see the old map. (Dar Es Salaam will have a fleet and Windhoek an army though) (Abbveriations are only to be included in versions good enough for playtest)
2: Only the provinces in the nations core area are home centers. For the european powers, this is only thier european provinces. For USA, this is the centers of the continous states (Washington, Miami and Los Angeles). The remaining 6 power have all thier starting centers as home centers. An illustrating map
3: A colonial build can be ordered in a supply center which is not a home center of an excisting nation, but the build will not be in effect until the winter after the build was ordered. The province has to be empty and without other effective orders to it (unless canceled) at the actual build occation and on the order occation. For the build to be succesful must the nation have capacity for one build both at the order occation and the build occation.
The syntax for a colonial build is the same as for a regular build. A conolial build can be canceled with the syntax
Cancel Build Army Switzerland
C +A Swi
Another unit can be ordred to build in its place.
A lack of any note about the colonial build means it is still in effect. In a case of over ordering builds the colonial build are resolved unless they too are over ordered. (This do not apply for colonial builds being ordered, only being built)
4: Victory is archived when owning 55 SC. (This is the official vanilla requierment, but can often become very hard to archive. I thus recomend any GM to conceder using another victory condition. Some proposals could be 36 SCs (Equal to the entire European scean) or First to conquer one continent (America, Europe or Asia).

An extra, pacific centered map.
Additional extra. RP file for v. 0.1

This is a variant I'm working on. The idea is that we take the standard map, change no borders or such at all, but add the world outside. The outside map is made as the standard, the world 1914, with changes removing really small places like Luxembourg or Montenegro, and as many islands as possible. There are no rule changes, but I might add a rule. That would then have to do with colonies and building there. I'm thinking right now that there would be a one year delay before build in colonies, but that's still not set in stone.

Here's the map

It's still very preliminary, and lot's of changes will be made.

Anyway, constructive comments are welcome.

EDIT: Just noticed Japans borders were hard to see. I've jsut made no-Russian asia. here's a pic with Japans borders in black, and twice the size.

If anyone want to see any area closer, I'll provide a zoomed pic.

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posts: 249 | location: On the handle of a dagger. | joined: 23 Jun 2007

King of Swords
Dignitary

Tue Jun 26, 2007 12:10 pm

It looks very cool to me! This kind of global map variant is one of the things I'm most interested in.

I do note that you have a lot of mid-ocean spaces that don't touch land at all, particularly in the North Atlantic. Are you sure that you want that area to be so complex? It will sure slow down trans-Atlantic warfare.

Bob

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It would be easier, sometimes, to change the past."
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posts: 174 | location: Portland, OR, US Pacific NW | joined: 26 Nov 2006 | medals: 1

Uhlan
Adjutant

Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:40 am

A fellow named John Armstrong did a Global variant back around 98-99 called alternately World Dip or Global Dip. It's listed in the Variant Bank as
Global Dip II

The gimmick his game had was Continental Dependancy.

Say wha?

Quote:

the units of a continent must be supported by supply centers of the same continent

Each unit is supported by a center on one of the 5 continents. For instance; if you had 5 European centers/units and 3 N American centers/units and lost 1 Euro center, but gained 3 South American centers - you would have to loose 1 European unit - no matter where on Earth it happened to be, and could build 3 units IN South America.

For games I ran I used square armies and triangular fleets with a color band across the bottom denoting what continent they belonged to - worked very well:

Getting this variant to work in RP or JDip is another matter. It would obviously require manual record keeping on the side.

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posts: 23 | location: Pasadena Maryland USA | joined: 22 Jun 2007

Snake IV
Emissary

Wed Jun 27, 2007 12:49 pm

Thanks for showing interest. Smile

The atlantic sure makes a point, and the aspect of colonial armies is interesting, although not what I have in mind for this map.

I've chenged some stuff since the last map. I did remove some seazones in the atlantic, but I might remove some more later. Standard for global maps seems to be two spaces between european and american SCs, but three aren't too uncommon either. I've removed 3 english units and SCs, aden bengali and malaysia. I've moved the turkish SC and unit in mecca to north yemen. I've removed a province in the middle east. I'ev split up French indochina in three provinces, and i've moved the lanlocked fleet in brazil to a coastal SC.

I've also made a preliminary decition upon colonies. There will not be any special colony SC, but rather you will be able to build in any SC classified colonial (a SC further away from any home SC than 3 spaces, that is not a home SC of a existing power) that you have owned for at least two years or since the beginning of the game. Then on the time it will take to build in colonies I have not yet decided. Either it will take one year, or it will take as many years as the shortest distance from your nearest home SC is divided by 2 (or perhaps another number). In either case the province must be owned and empty and the nation must have at least one build to go both at the start of the building and at the end of it. In between does not matter (which would acctually make it possible to have several nations having a build onging in the same province at the same time with the latter variant of the build time rules. Very Happy

)

And here is the map

EDIT: I've yet to decide on if I should have the asian SC for Russia Korea for Japan, and yemen for Turkey as home SC. Suggestions are welcome. Wink

posts: 249 | location: On the handle of a dagger. | joined: 23 Jun 2007

bmtc
Emissary

Fri Jun 29, 2007 8:10 pm

I would say Pacific Russia is home, but Korea and Yemen are not.

posts: 403 | location: Texas | joined: 04 Jul 2006

Ciaran
Adjutant

Sun Jul 01, 2007 5:41 am

As a fellow paradoxian (naraic) its with pleasure that I see you on this forum. I like the idea but I think it needs work

For reference
USA 4
England 13
Mexico 3
France 10
Austria 3
Germany 7
Turkey 5
Brazil 3
Argentina 3
Japan 4
China 4
Columbia 2
Italy 4
Russia 7

Ok so some suggestions you should give Brazil a better position vis a vis Argentina. In this map Argentina is guaranteed 2 neutrals while brazil gets one. Columbias position with abundant neutrals gives it a good opportunity to grow and swing into a strong position.

The USA should have 5 or 6 SCs rather than merely 4 as historically it would have had the capabillity to assert local superiority over both Mexico and england.

China could do to lose an SC perhaps the tibetan one and french indochina should lose one of the two buffer spaces to give the unit there a greater chance of marching east towards siam.

Either the northern approaches to America should be combined into less sea zones or the southern approaches should be divided into more just for a sense of balance.

posts: 318 | joined: 17 Sep 2006

bmtc
Emissary

Sun Jul 01, 2007 7:54 am

The US does have six supply centers, you're probably missing the ones in Hawaii and the Phillipines.

posts: 403 | location: Texas | joined: 04 Jul 2006

Snake IV
Emissary

Sun Jul 01, 2007 7:58 am

Nice suggestions, fellow paradoxian. I should note though that USA does have 6 SC, you've probably missed Hawaii and the Phillipines (when it's up to US contra England and mexico: Englands Canadian position sucks IMO, I might reduce Mexico to 2 SC though, but US shouldn't become to strong) . Italy has 5, and England has 15 SC, but the latter number will probably continue to sink a little bit. The suggestion about asia, making China 3 SC and givign indochina a stronger position. I can redo the Indochina borders, the current ones are like they are casue I've been lazy. Though I'm not sure if I want the French to have a secure gain 1901 over there. I see their presens mostly as a buffert. I'll not take away the western SC for china, I have a good battleground in Afghanistan and Persia. A too strong China might be best compensated with sronger neithbours IMO. It's easy to transfer a english SC to the area and fit it in with new borders.

Other than that your thoughts are spot on. I hadn't noticed Argentina had it so easy to hinder Brazil to even gain at all in that area. I've mostly been concerned with that Argentina is a bit unflexible to where they should go. And the more time that past the more I'm sure that the seazones should be remade almost form scratch

posts: 249 | location: On the handle of a dagger. | joined: 23 Jun 2007

Ciaran
Adjutant

Sun Jul 01, 2007 9:42 am

One more suggestion have you considered giving Germany a bit more muscle on the continent. In 1914 they along with AH and the turks managed to make havoc for UK Russia and France. While I dont suggest giving them a 8 SCs to match Britain giving them an additional SC on the continent may be worthwhile. Perhaps you could adopt 1900s internal borders for Germany? A 1900 map can be found here for the moment or you can look on diplom.org I'm sure its there too.

http://www.redscape.com/forum/.....hp?t=42541

posts: 318 | joined: 17 Sep 2006

bmtc
Emissary

Sun Jul 01, 2007 1:20 pm

I think it might be good to just adopt the entire 1900 map as the base map for Europe.

posts: 403 | location: Texas | joined: 04 Jul 2006

GMTom
Administrator

Sun Jul 01, 2007 6:06 pm

I love large global games and yours is quite different from either of mine but you did mention one rule that did work well in my WW4 game. In that game you could build in any conquered supply center after a 2 year delay, if you take it in year 1, you could build in year 3 (sounds like what you mentioned as your idea?) That worked well and allowed other powers to react, if you don't allow conquered centers to be built in, it slows the game down far too much.

The one change I would consider is to alter Europe a bit, no need to keep it identical to the standard game now that you add outside influences. Oh, and the sea zones should probably be reduced some as well? I say this because the way it is currently set up, you seem to have several games all on the same map, Europe will hardly affect North America or vice versa, they are too far apart to effectively land forces in any real numbers on the other side, same goes with South America' Africa and Asia. Each seems to be a n island unto themselves, I would think you would want encourage such cross continental encroachment? Either reduce the seas or make the map much bigger with more supply centers to make the crossings possible.

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Lackadaisacal
Adjutant

Thu Aug 16, 2007 4:31 am

I like GMTom, mostly because he is polite, rarely late, and enjoys a nice pair of slacks.

Snake IV, I think that the US should have fleets where the have armies and armies where they have fleets. and I would replace either create 2/3 african nations or make those neutrals. great map tho. Very Happy

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commandant
Statesman

Wed Aug 22, 2007 1:13 am

Me thinks AH would be in Huge trouble in this game. After all while AH was not Germany its military power was much the same as France and Russia and far greater than Turkeym, Italy and England, Of course England's military power was non exsistant before world war one as all their strenght was in their navy. I would suggest ditching the AH Fleet as the AH Fleet of 1914 was a collection of rust and replace it with an army as in 1900. Also I would move the Italian SC to Milan in order to place a buffer zone between Italy and AH. Also I would make Ireland passable and give it a SC as ireland provided almost 30% of the men for British Armies before WW1 and provided upwards of 200,000 men for that war effort I think it only fair they get an SC

posts: 203 | joined: 17 Jul 2005

Snake IV
Emissary

Sat Oct 06, 2007 5:21 am

I had pretty much forgot about this variant, and this thread. Should get back working on it again soon.

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sirdanilot
Emissary

Sat Oct 06, 2007 7:14 am

The black color for impassable areas and German areas is a bit confusing. I'd give the impassable areas another color.

I'd also make Iceland and Ireland passable, but not Supply Centers. Having islands is always fun.

The atlantic really needs to be redone I think. I'd create larger and simpler territories with straight line borders (the last isn't tactically important but still).

How about making Indonesia a nation? Maybe that would require some editing, but it'd be cool I guess.

Maybe the map could be made a little bit more easy to understand. For example, the space between Cuba and Haiti island. Does haiti belong to Cuba or are they two seperate areas with a separate sea between them?
I also think the southern ocean could be made a little bit less complex. I don't think a lot is going to happen there anyway.

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